Fat middle-aged males

[jdaw1]

My wife and I are writing a website for her chiropractic business. One of the pages is about people who can be helped. There’s a section entitled “Children and babies”, then “Pregnant women”, and then “Exercise enthusiasts”. None of these categories need concern us. The next section, in the current draft of the website, goes as follows, and SWMBO wants opinion other than mine.

Fat middle-aged males

(The title of this section was chosen by my husband—I vetoed his other term: “masculine and prosperous physique”.) Excess weight can put knees and lower back under a lot of stress. Weight at the front pushes the body off balance, it causes the spine to curve excessively, which in turn can cause disc problems, ligament stretching, and stress fractures.

A short-term reduction in pain, typically by un-pinching a nerve, can make people more mobile and able to get about, which can help lose (or not gain) weight.

Longer-term, you feel healthier, sleep better (lack of sleep causes lack of energy causes hunger), gain energy and mobility, and the immune system works better.

But, as I tell my husband, what’s better than just chiropractic adjustments are both chiropractic adjustments and weight loss.

Is this a good idea? (Good idea = attract customers. Bad idea = not attract customers .)

[djewesbury]

I'd go.

[djewesbury]

(Were I fat)

[SCP-DFF]

I'd go.

Really? When Julian proposed this, I was shocked. I mean, "Fat Middle-Aged Men"? To me, that's offensive and a bit repulsive. Julian says no. Julian says it's a tractor beam pulling in FMAM.

So I need reassurance that he's right. Is this Julian being Julian? Or is this Julian just being male and I don't understand this like I don't understand Chinese?

Thanks for your comments!

MAW.

[djewesbury]

I think it's disarming and friendly. I agree with Julian. It's good to have information such as this delivered with some informality. It doesn't offend and it doesn't trivialise.

[AW77]

Well, if I was a customer, I'd like to know more about the weight loss. So you should offer some advice on that.
Instead of fat middle-aged males, you could call them "weight-challenged male mid-agers".

[LGTrotter]

People always think of other people being fat, not themselves. They may beat themselves up with it at times but they don't really believe it.

So I'm more a no.

[jdaw1]

People always think of other people being fat, not themselves.

Is that concern lessened by the previous section being entitled “Exercise enthusiasts”? Also, is the target audience the FMAM, or is it the wives of the FMAM? And if the latter, will the description encourage or discourage them?

[LGTrotter]

I think your sense (Julian) of wanting a little less euphemism than suggested in the first draft is a good one. I think you may have followed this to it's logical conclusion with more enthusiasm than I might have suggested. For instance overweight is pithy without having the slight internal cringe fat comes with.

[Glenn E.]

I'd go.

Really? When Julian proposed this, I was shocked. I mean, "Fat Middle-Aged Men"? To me, that's offensive and a bit repulsive. Julian says no. Julian says it's a tractor beam pulling in FMAM.

I must side with the better half on this one.

If I saw that on a website, I'd leave the site. It does not seem professional to me.

[DRT]

I'd go.

Really? When Julian proposed this, I was shocked. I mean, "Fat Middle-Aged Men"? To me, that's offensive and a bit repulsive. Julian says no. Julian says it's a tractor beam pulling in FMAM.

I must side with the better half on this one.

If I saw that on a website, I'd leave the site. It does not seem professional to me.

+1

Some might find it amusing, and then not become a customer.

Some might find it repulsive, and not become a customer.

A few might not open that page, and some of those might become customers.

I'd ditch it.

[jdaw1]

Glenn, DRT: would the substitution suggested by Owen (+overweight, −fat) remedy the problem?

[DRT]

Glenn, DRT: would the substitution suggested by Owen (+overweight, −fat) remedy the problem?

The intent behind the message is fine, but the page needs to be written by someone who has a modicum of empathy and tact - i.e. not you.

MAW should have a go at writing something about how her treatments can help those who wish to lose or control their weight and post it in this thread for critique.

[djewesbury]

the page needs to be written by someone who has a modicum of empathy and tact - i.e. not you.

A year's amnesty from Apostrophe Crimes for DRT.

[flash_uk]

People always think of other people being fat, not themselves.

Is that concern lessened by the previous section being entitled “Exercise enthusiasts”? Also, is the target audience the FMAM, or is it the wives of the FMAM? And if the latter, will the description encourage or discourage them?

Without doubt the wives are the target. Everything I have done in the past year related to health had been booked by my wife. Doctor, dentist, dental hygienist, osteo, first visit to personal trainer, skin cancer check etc. I would add some words to the page which leave the wife in no doubt that booking an appointment for hubby will be a wonderfully successful venture.

[jdaw1]

I would add some words to the page which leave the wife in no doubt that booking an appointment for hubby will be a wonderfully successful venture.

Exercise averse

Being heavy can put knees and lower back under a lot of stress. Weight at the front pushes the body off balance, it causes the spine to curve excessively, which in turn can cause disc problems, ligament stretching, and stress fractures.

A short-term reduction in pain, typically by un-pinching a nerve, can make people more mobile and able to get about, which can help lose (or not gain) weight.

Longer-term, you feel healthier, sleep better (lack of sleep causes lack of energy causes hunger), gain energy and mobility, and the immune system works better.

And men, if you’re too shy to book for yourself, ask your lovely wife to book both of you!

Is this a good idea? (Good idea = attract customers. Bad idea = not attract customers.) Rephrased, would the target audience think that “Exercise averse” applies to themselves? (And yes, I know, I still prefer honesty to tact.)

[PhilW]

My wife and I are writing a website for her chiropractic business. One of the pages is about people who can be helped. There’s a section entitled “Children and babies”, then “Pregnant women”, and then “Exercise enthusiasts”. None of these categories need concern us. The next section, in the current draft of the website, goes as follows, and SWMBO wants opinion other than mine.

Fat middle-aged males

(The title of this section was chosen by my husband—I vetoed his other term: “masculine and prosperous physique”.) Excess weight can put knees and lower back under a lot of stress. Weight at the front pushes the body off balance, it causes the spine to curve excessively, which in turn can cause disc problems, ligament stretching, and stress fractures.

A short-term reduction in pain, typically by un-pinching a nerve, can make people more mobile and able to get about, which can help lose (or not gain) weight.

Longer-term, you feel healthier, sleep better (lack of sleep causes lack of energy causes hunger), gain energy and mobility, and the immune system works better.

But, as I tell my husband, what’s better than just chiropractic adjustments are both chiropractic adjustments and weight loss.

Is this a good idea? (Good idea = attract customers. Bad idea = not attract customers .)

Bad idea. Most of the text is good, but the opening line while being an attention grabber will also be read as "hey fatty!" with the implicit social disdain, which would be off-putting for many seeking professional help; I would also note that nothing in your text seems to be gender-specific, so am not sure why this is titled only for men; even if men are your primary target, would the information not be just as valid for women? "Overweight and middle-aged?" might be softer and sufficient, as well as not implying criticism.

Your first two paragraphs are great, as they actually provide informative explanation, and highlight that having such treatment may help prevent further gain or aid loss, which will be received very positively. I think however that you ruin it at the end with your last comment; almost everyone who is fat knows that it would be better for their health if they lost weight, they don't need to be told this, and may well find it patronising, which is not the way you wish them to feel on finishing reading you text. For most people who are overweight, the difficulty is one of motivation to take the steps needed to lose it; they may be motivated based on a better understanding the health benefits they may gain or the consequences of not losing and/or gaining further weight (which is why your second paragraph is probably the best sales pitch).

[PhilW]

Glenn, DRT: would the substitution suggested by Owen (+overweight, −fat) remedy the problem?

The intent behind the message is fine, but the page needs to be written by someone who has a modicum of empathy and tact - i.e. not you.

I think you should stop pussy-footing around and say what you really think!

[PhilW]

Rephrased, would the target audience think that “Exercise averse” applies to themselves? (And yes, I know, I still prefer honesty to tact.)

No, not for me personally, though I don't know whether my situation would be typical of your target audience (though I expect I would be among it). I wrote a longer and more detailed response, but decided it was too personal to post; happy to respond more fully by PM, but think you already know my situation.

[jdaw1]

I think you like these bits:

Excess weight can put knees and lower back under a lot of stress. Weight at the front pushes the body off balance, it causes the spine to curve excessively, which in turn can cause disc problems, ligament stretching, and stress fractures.

A short-term reduction in pain, typically by un-pinching a nerve, can make people more mobile and able to get about, which can help lose (or not gain) weight.

Longer-term, you feel healthier, sleep better (lack of sleep causes lack of energy causes hunger), gain energy and mobility, and the immune system works better.

In which case all that’s needed is a title says and doesn’t say and why are people so unwilling to state truth? Please suggest a title.

[PhilW]

In which case all that’s needed is a title says and doesn’t say and why are people so unwilling to state truth? Please suggest a title.

Ask that again please?

[flash_uk]

Please suggest a title.

How about "Taking good care of middle-aged men". Turns it into a lovely altruistic jolly considerate endeavour. The subsequent text can elaborate and point out that the dangers to be guarded against are excessive weight, high blood pressure, blah blah blah.

[djewesbury]

Ok, I'm also now unsure why only males who are middle-aged are being reached out to. And I understand others' aversion to the text as it stands. I agree that Julian's directness could be off-putting for some though personally I think that the internet is often a place where a tongue-in-cheek tone is used to sell more readily than in other media. Armed with an answer to the first question above and some further discussion on who the target audience are (men / their wives / women), a solution is now a mere five pages away.

[DRT]

Is this Julian being Julian?

Yes. And he is now being even more Julian by not giving into the fact that it was a bad idea and he should submit to your preference rather than tinkering around with the problem.

I enjoy reading Julian's direct style of writing on his website, here on , in emails and text telling me I'm about to die, etc. I, and I suspect 99% of the population, am not attracted to websites advertising professional services that are written in that style.

I am sure Julian will be very helpful when it comes to making it all into a website, although it will probably be very minimalistic with no warm and fuzzy aesthetic appeal. However, I think you or someone who understands what is appealing or unappealing to your potential audience should write the content.

[djewesbury]

I was worried about the aesthetics myself. Clearly nothing that has been added to the W3 standards since 1993 will be allowed.

[djewesbury]

Derek's right. I give way.

[jdaw1]

An opinion was sought and then probed. And it is clear. The FMAM § must die.

And fret not about the aesthetics. Matters are in hand.

[djewesbury]

Oh good. You've got the same team that did the Cask 33 website.

[SCP-DFF]

Your first two paragraphs are great, as they actually provide informative explanation, and highlight that having such treatment may help prevent further gain or aid loss, which will be received very positively. I think however that you ruin it at the end with your last comment; almost everyone who is fat knows that it would be better for their health if they lost weight, they don't need to be told this, and may well find it patronising, which is not the way you wish them to feel on finishing reading you text. For most people who are overweight, the difficulty is one of motivation to take the steps needed to lose it; they may be motivated based on a better understanding the health benefits they may gain or the consequences of not losing and/or gaining further weight (which is why your second paragraph is probably the best sales pitch).

Thank you Phil. That's very helpful.

[SCP-DFF]

Is this Julian being Julian?

Yes. And he is now being even more Julian by not giving into the fact that it was a bad idea and he should submit to your preference rather than tinkering around with the problem.

I enjoy reading Julian's direct style of writing on his website, here on , in emails and text telling me I'm about to die, etc. I, and I suspect 99% of the population, am not attracted to websites advertising professional services that are written in that style.

I am sure Julian will be very helpful when it comes to making it all into a website, although it will probably be very minimalistic with no warm and fuzzy aesthetic appeal. However, I think you or someone who understands what is appealing or unappealing to your potential audience should write the content.

Thank you, Derek. You're right. I agree. I do enjoy my husband's wit and banter very much. However, there is a certain 'tone' that I am attempting to achieve on my website.

Thank you, everyone, for being so open and honest about this. I really appreciate it!

(My next question: what port is everyone drinking tonight on a regular Friday night?)

— MaryAnne.

[LGTrotter]

No port for me tonight (there may be thimble of Tesco 94 for later) but on Alex's advice and because they are on offer at Sainsburys a half bottle of Moët NV. And a half bottle of Bollinger to take the taste away afterwards.

Despite being a bit sniffy about the Moët in the past me and Emma have had much fun this afternoon saying; "No Moët, no Showay" and "No Chandon, no band on" to each other (quote from Spinal Tap for those of you too benighted to have come across this before).

[djewesbury]

Oh you rock and roll youths. I am still recovering from my combo of chest illnesses so no port for me either. I sincerely hope to open something tomorrow though. Perhaps a Graham 85 would be in order.

[PopulusTremula]

No port. Armagnac for me tonight.

[Glenn E.]

Glenn, DRT: would the substitution suggested by Owen (+overweight, −fat) remedy the problem?

The intent behind the message is fine, but the page needs to be written by someone who has a modicum of empathy and tact - i.e. not you.

MAW should have a go at writing something about how her treatments can help those who wish to lose or control their weight and post it in this thread for critique.

+1

I'd like to see that as well.

[Glenn E.]

(My next question: what port is everyone drinking tonight on a regular Friday night?)

Sadly, none for me tonight. I have a mild, persistent, aggravating head cold that is just sufficient to spoil my ability to enjoy food and drink.

[djewesbury]

Get well soon Glenn.

[SCP-DFF]

My website is now live. Thank you to you all for posting and commenting. Very helpful!

http://www.shiozawawellness.com

— SCP-DFF

[flash_uk]

"My family, three children? Or four?"

Priceless.

[SCP-DFF]

"My family, three children? Or four?"

Priceless.

That, my dear, was Julian's witty brilliance for that caption.

[djewesbury]

Beautiful website. Lovely family.

[DRT]

Very good, and almost free of middle aged fat blokes

One comment from me: I can understand the reason for the disclaimer but I do not think it is required on every page. That strikes me (because I know him) as JDAW paranoia, but to the casual visitor it looks somewhat apologetic and attracts too much attention to what is very much a peripheral issue for those seeking treatment. I would suggest cutting down to one instance on the contact page and leave the other pages clean. You can then place a copy of the disclaimer prominently on the form you will have new patients sign consenting to treatment, thereby giving yourself the legal protection JDAW is no doubt seeking for you.

I wish you every success.

[djewesbury]

Well spotted. Agree.

[jdaw1]

The GCC charge a lot of money and hassle to be registered. The money presumably because of its big debts (don’t ask how accumulated). Some legal paranoia necessary.

Earlier this year the GCC sent a letter about her Facebook page mentioning the word “chiropractor”: further correspondence is expected.