ThePortForum.com

Posted: **22:46 Tue 10 Mar 2015**

What's he gone and done now?

The BBC appear to have a worse choice to make than the ECB. Sack Clarkson and watch Top Gear ratings fall through the floor and BBC Worldwide profits halve while at the same time watch a bidding war spark off between Sky, BT Sport, Virgin and ITV for the successor to Top Gear or back down and not sack the man who had his final warning last year.

As a Top Gear fan I am mighty pissed off that the last three episodes of this eight episode series have been pulled. Guess I'll just have to resort to Dave.

Posted: **23:42 Tue 10 Mar 2015**

AHB wrote:a worse choice to make than the ECB.

The choices of the ECB are constrained by the Maastricht Treaty, which was a combination of the French desiring to constrain the Germans, and the Bundesbank desiring to constrain everybody. Not pretty. And an even less pretty outcome, especially for the Greeks. But at least we escaped, mostly thanks to a cricket-loving Prime Minister.

Posted: **00:04 Wed 11 Mar 2015**

You don't see so much of Jim Davidson on telly these days either...

*falls to the floor laughing*

Posted: **04:23 Wed 11 Mar 2015**

I, too, am a Top Gear fan and this saddens me. Is there any further information about what happened?

Posted: **08:36 Wed 11 Mar 2015**

Apparently the knuckle-dragging self-publicist threw a punch at a producer. That's a sacking offence even for such a delicate starlet as him.
I don't believe that TG is the only thing that makes money in the BBC Worldwide basket. And if it is, then it's probably time for the darkness to descend on us all.

Posted: **10:19 Wed 11 Mar 2015**

I think the ECB should sack Moores and give the job to Clarkson.

Posted: **13:15 Wed 11 Mar 2015**

The BBC, in an article entitled [url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-31832698]Top Gear: 300,000 sign petition supporting Jeremy Clarkson[/url], wrote:An online petition calling for the BBC to "reinstate" Top Gear presenter Jeremy Clarkson has been signed by more than 300,000 people.

Clarkson, 54, was suspended after a "fracas" with a BBC producer thought to work on the show.

Sunday's episode of Top Gear will not be shown, and it is understood the two final episodes in the series will also be dropped.

The petition was started on Tuesday by political blogger Guido Fawkes.

It reached the 250,000 mark by mid-morning on Wednesday.

Asked about the Clarkson incident, co-presenter James May told BBC News: "I think he's been involved in a bit of a dust-up and I don't think it's that serious." He said he had not been present.

Earlier on Wednesday, Clarkson's retweeted a message to his 4.5m Twitter followers from a Top Gear viewer which read: "How can BBC not show the remaining episodes of Top Gear, can't this be resolved without making the fans suffer?"

Posted: **14:13 Wed 11 Mar 2015**

djewesbury wrote:Apparently the knuckle-dragging self-publicist

And that is why I watch Top Gear. It is so much more entertaining than when it was a car show being presented by Quentin Blake Willson and Vicki B-H.

djewesbury wrote:threw a punch at a producer. That's a sacking offence even for such a delicate starlet as him.

Nonsense. There's always wriggle room. If the Beeb wants to keep him they will find a way to do so. If they don't want to keep him then there will be a lot of money thrown at him to change allegiance.

djewesbury wrote:I don't believe that TG is the only thing that makes money in the BBC Worldwide basket. And if it is, then it's probably time for the darkness to descend on us all.

Of course it isn't. Doctor Who and Sherlock Holmes also make money. Just not as much combined as does Top Gear.

LGTrotter wrote:You don't see so much of Jim Davidson on telly these days either...

Neither was he as entertaining as Clarkson; nor did he make as much money for his TV company.

DRT wrote:I think the ECB should sack Moores and give the job to Clarkson.

I think this is the best suggestion yet. Whether it be the England & Wales Cricket Board or the European Central Bank. In either case, appoint Clarkson to run it.

Posted: **14:14 Wed 11 Mar 2015**

A petition to reinstate him strikes me as being as irrelevant as a petition against fog.

Posted: **14:15 Wed 11 Mar 2015**

djewesbury wrote:A petition to reinstate him strikes me as being as irrelevant as a petition against fog.

You are quite correct. How can you reinstate someone when they have not been removed?

Being deliberately obtuse? Moi? I don't know what you mean.

Posted: **14:16 Wed 11 Mar 2015**

AHB wrote:
DRT wrote:I think the ECB should sack Moores and give the job to Clarkson.
I think this is the best suggestion yet. Whether it be the England & Wales Cricket Board or the European Central Bank. In either case, appoint Clarkson to run it.

Should we start a petition on Twitter?

Posted: **14:18 Wed 11 Mar 2015**

I don't think you're being obtuse Alex. Or at least, not obtuse enough!

Posted: **14:22 Wed 11 Mar 2015**

It's all just a big PR campaign.

Posted: **19:02 Wed 11 Mar 2015**

BBC: Jeremy Clarkson jokes about suspension as petition tops 400,000.

Posted: **19:21 Wed 11 Mar 2015**

David Cameron thinks he's a 'talent'. How are you spelling that, Dave?

Posted: **20:39 Wed 11 Mar 2015**

djewesbury wrote:David Cameron thinks he's a 'talent'. How are you spelling that, Dave?

I think Clarkson has "A Talent to Annoy", though I fear that this joke is an insult to Nancy Mitford.

Posted: **20:57 Wed 11 Mar 2015**

Thank you André. Good to hear from you!

Posted: **23:47 Thu 12 Mar 2015**

BBC News wrote:What is a 'fracas'?

"Fracas" has French roots but it is originally from the Italian "fracassare", to cause uproar.

Its first noted use in English was in 1727, according to the Oxford English Dictionary. The writer Lady Mary Worley Montagu wrote in a letter: "A… violent fracas took place between the infantry-colonel and his lady."

If you speak British English, you pronounce it "frah-car", but Americans tend to pronounce it "fray-cuss".

Odd, I pronounce it with a short 'a' sound. More "frack-us".

Posted: **01:03 Fri 13 Mar 2015**

Oh, the linguistic confusion around Jeremy Clarkson.
As Charlie Brooker says, he's funny because he's racist!

Posted: **19:51 Fri 13 Mar 2015**

i thought I would take advantage of the hiatus in this cultural thread to introduce a cultural concern of my own which I was originally going to address to Andre only. But on consideration I think I should throw it open to all comers.

How should I approach the poet Rilke?

I have an anthology, with translation by the rather pleasingly titled Michael Hamburger. However I find the poems rather soaring, almost with the nausea of motion and I distrust the translation.

Any advice?

Posted: **20:40 Fri 13 Mar 2015**

Posted: **20:57 Fri 13 Mar 2015**

jdaw1 wrote:

Of course I agree that the muscular symbolism of Brecht is an easier starting point. Thank you Julian.

Posted: **21:24 Fri 13 Mar 2015**

But don't you think that Brecht's use of the modern and ordinary is a poor introduction to the individual and inward symbolism of Rilke?

Posted: **22:14 Fri 13 Mar 2015**

LGTrotter wrote:But don't you think that Brecht's use of the modern and ordinary is a poor introduction to the individual and inward symbolism of Rilke?

Perhaps you could seek solace in a few YouTube videos of Pam Ayers?

Posted: **22:25 Fri 13 Mar 2015**

DRT wrote:
LGTrotter wrote:But don't you think that Brecht's use of the modern and ordinary is a poor introduction to the individual and inward symbolism of Rilke?
Perhaps you could seek solace in a few YouTube videos of Pam Ayers?

I bloody love Pam Ayres. She's lovely.

Posted: **23:15 Fri 13 Mar 2015**

LGTrotter wrote:i thought I would take advantage of the hiatus in this cultural thread to introduce a cultural concern of my own which I was originally going to address to Andre only. But on consideration I think I should throw it open to all comers.

How should I approach the poet Rilke?

I have an anthology, with translation by the rather pleasingly titled Michael Hamburger. However I find the poems rather soaring, almost with the nausea of motion and I distrust the translation.

Any advice?

I must admit that I never read poetry, so I don't know Rilke. But from what I read online at Project Gutenberg I must say that his poems are kind of weird and boring.

If you don't like the translation you have, try to get another one. The German Wikipedia lists some:
„Larenopfer“, translated by Alfred de Zayas, Red Hen Press, Los Angeles, 2005
The Essential Rilke, selected poens translated by Galway Kinnell und Hannah Liebmann, The Ecco Press, Hopewell, New Jersey, 1999.
Rilke. Selected Poems translated by C.F. MacIntyre, University of California Press, Berkeley, 1940.
The Book of Images translated by Edward Snow, North Point Press, New York, 1991.
The best of Rilke translated by Walter Arndt, University Press of New England, Hanover, 1984, ISBN 0-87451-460-6 / ISBN 0-87451-461-4.
Selected Poems of Rainer Maria Rilke, translated by Robert Bly, Harper & Row, New York 1981.

But I doubt that other translations would improve your liking of Rilke much.

Posted: **00:03 Sat 14 Mar 2015**

We have gone from Top Gear to translations of Rilke. At least one must be off-topic, because they cannot be the same topic.

Posted: **09:55 Sat 14 Mar 2015**

Owen, have you read Antonio Tabucchi's novel 'Pereira Maintains'? I heartily recommend it if not; if you've ever read and liked Saramago you'll enjoy it. I mention it because I just read it the other day and was amused at the description of Rilke therein, which was not unlike André's. The book is set in Lisbon in 1938 as the fascists are closing in. There is more than one mention of 'dry port'.
Have you ever tried Heine? Of course, Marx was a fan. But I've never got round to him myself.

Posted: **10:06 Sat 14 Mar 2015**

jdaw1 wrote:We have gone from Top Gear to translations of Rilke. At least one must be off-topic, because they cannot be the same topic.

You're right, of course. The thread should be renamed Cultural Studies.

Posted: **11:13 Sat 14 Mar 2015**

Rainer Rilke in [i]Letters of Rainer Rilke[/i] wrote:He used to stay up on top, and ... according as the event and the occasion geared them in.

Posted: **11:31 Sat 14 Mar 2015**

PhilW wrote:
Rainer Rilke in [i]Letters of Rainer Rilke[/i] wrote:He used to stay up on top, and ... according as the event and the occasion geared them in.

Posted: **14:24 Sat 14 Mar 2015**

djewesbury wrote:Have you ever tried Heine? Of course, Marx was a fan. But I've never got round to him myself.

Heine is a good suggestion. He wrote intellectually sharp satire, which I think Owen will like. In addition to that, he wrote a lot of prose which is easier to translate than poetry. By the way: somehow Owen bears a resemblance to Heine:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heinrich_H ... _Heine.PNG

Posted: **14:25 Sat 14 Mar 2015**

djewesbury wrote:
jdaw1 wrote:We have gone from Top Gear to translations of Rilke. At least one must be off-topic, because they cannot be the same topic.
You're right, of course. The thread should be renamed Cultural Studies.

Good suggestion. Or we might name it "A place for the Highbrow"

Posted: **00:05 Tue 17 Mar 2015**

AW77 wrote:By the way: somehow Owen bears a resemblance to Heine:

: image.jpg (9.87 KiB) Viewed 34275 times

Well it's about time somebody noticed my new bonnet. Thank you Andre, you say the nicest things.

Posted: **21:18 Tue 17 Mar 2015**

Owen, there was no offence intended. It was meant as a compliment.
Is your picture of portrait of Madame Clicqout?

Posted: **21:47 Tue 17 Mar 2015**

AW77 wrote:Owen, there was no offence intended.

I know that Andre, the picture is from the Wiki link for Heine, it is his mother and the picture made me laugh. She does look like Madame Cliquot, with a touch of Whistler's mother thrown in.

Posted: **01:45 Wed 18 Mar 2015**

I happen to agree with André. There is a dashing look about young Heinrich which certainly reminds me of you, Owen.

Posted: **15:01 Wed 25 Mar 2015**

He's been sacked, my favorite show will never be the same

Posted: **16:16 Wed 25 Mar 2015**

It is a sad day for Top Gear.

Posted: **18:05 Wed 25 Mar 2015**

Not at all. I can smell the future coming.

Posted: **22:49 Wed 25 Mar 2015**

djewesbury wrote:Not at all. I can smell the future coming.

Or this might just be the smell of JC's exhaust.

Posted: **23:44 Wed 25 Mar 2015**

Well I have a meeting with a senior exec in the Beeb next week. A coincidence? Or a pinko takeover? You decide.

Posted: **01:12 Thu 26 Mar 2015**

I'd just take the crew and do it on another channel...

Posted: **12:39 Thu 26 Mar 2015**

mosesbotbol wrote:I'd just take the crew and do it on another channel...

Does the UK have another channel?

Posted: **17:29 Thu 26 Mar 2015**

mosesbotbol wrote:I'd just take the crew and do it on another channel...

If Sky want to plough in the millions that the BBC committed to this programme, let them. Everyone goes on about what an asset this programme was to the Beeb, generating many millions in worldwide sales. Yes, of course. But it was also built up by the BBC, over years, using their expertise and their enormous resources. I would imagine it's one of the most expensive factual programmes out there.
Shouldn't Clarkson be a little more grateful for the wonderful career the BBC gave him? He seems to be a very ungracious millionaire.

Posted: **18:29 Thu 26 Mar 2015**

djewesbury wrote:He seems to be a very ungracious millionaire.

He isn't likely to find himself alone in that room.

Posted: **20:06 Thu 26 Mar 2015**

DRT wrote:
djewesbury wrote:He seems to be a very ungracious millionaire.
He isn't likely to find himself alone in that room.

Filtered through a very long trans-Atlantic lens, he actually appears to be rather pragmatic about it. He seems aware of the fact that he's an arse, seems mildly ashamed about it, but doesn't care enough to put in the (likely tremendous) effort required to change. In other words, he's okay with who he is even though he knows he's an arse.

In this particular case he let his temper get the best of him, screwed up badly, realized he'd screwed up badly, apologized in person (or at least tried) to the victim, and then reported himself for his actions knowing full well that he would probably be fired over it. I haven't seen anything indicating that he's trying to deflect blame in any way. He's owning his actions and seems sincerely sorry for it. Of course it's easier to be sorry when you know that it's not going to have any real impact on your career, but it does seem genuine from this side of the Atlantic.

That's an arse I can tolerate and maybe even support. If I were his boss I'd assign him a full-time handler, and that handler's job description in its entirety would be "do not allow Jeremy Clarkson to cross any lines. Tackle him if necessary. You are not his friend, you are his leash." It would be a cushy job, except when it wasn't.

Top Gear could be fine without Clarkson. They'd have to find the right person, but I like Richard better than Jeremy anyway. Jeremy's role (to me) is similar to the guy on ESPN who sits at the desk with the former NFL players and analysts and directs questions to them. He's the facilitator, but not actually key to the discussion. Jeremy's also one of the "experts" on Top Gear, but really his key role is to facilitate. That should be easy enough to replace, provided Hammond and May are willing.

Posted: **20:13 Thu 26 Mar 2015**

I can't find the link to Stewart Lee's great riff about Richard the hamster Hammond, who isn't a real hamster. Or maybe I can't be bothered posting it.

Posted: **20:15 Thu 26 Mar 2015**

Top Gear existed long ago, before Clarkson, if I recall correctly. Ah yes. Wikipedia confirms it was initially commissioned in 1977 and was presented by - wait for it - Angela Rippon! Be still my beating heart!

Posted: **20:17 Thu 26 Mar 2015**

In fact Clarkson has left once before (but nobody remembers because nobody cared). The rest of the team then decamped to Channel 5.

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