Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Talk about anything but keep it polite and reasonably clean.
LGTrotter
Dalva Golden White Colheita 1952
Posts: 3684
Joined: 17:45 Fri 19 Oct 2012
Location: Somerset, UK

Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by LGTrotter » 23:13 Fri 18 Jul 2014

flash_uk wrote:
LGTrotter wrote:...a copy of Decanter, plus wine awards bonus thing.
I have read the wine awards thing. I thought it was rubbish. I haven't got it to hand to be able to recount examples of what was rubbish, but I recall being bemused by the scarcity of wines assessed in some (many?) categories. And when you read the part about how they undertake the award process, it broadly seems to be: some people apply in a category, we taste, we make awards. So it seems to me that this is not really an attempt to find and assess what might be the outstanding wines in a category, but a half hearted process which any self-promoting producer can probably take advantage of.
I buy these magazines very sporadically and often by weight, so this seemed like a winner. Copies of Decanter I digest slowly over some months occasionally longer, so I have yet to find if it is rubbish or not. But so much wine journalism is awful; the old argument was that the people who knew about wine couldn't write and the journalists who could write didn't know about wine. What I can say is that wine writing seems to be done in the same factory that turns out airline mags. Which is terrible when I compare it to Waugh or even Mcinerney. I would make an exception for Jancis, she's great.

The point about self-promotion rather than quality is getting increasingly hard to ignore. And I suppose that wines wishing to be considered probably have to pay some nominal administration fee (read heavy irony here please).

But I was cheered to see Richard Mayson as the fortified judge, then rolled my eyes at the winner, a £210 1988 Bual, quite astonishingly over priced.

This probably needs a thread entitled 'wine journalism', thank you for uncovering this rich seam of unmined moaning. At least it's not cricket.

User avatar
DRT
Fonseca 1966
Posts: 15020
Joined: 23:51 Wed 20 Jun 2007
Location: Chesterfield, UK
Contact:

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by DRT » 23:25 Fri 18 Jul 2014

LGTrotter wrote:This probably needs a thread entitled 'wine journalism'
Done.
"The first duty of Port is to be red"

Ernest H. Cockburn

LGTrotter
Dalva Golden White Colheita 1952
Posts: 3684
Joined: 17:45 Fri 19 Oct 2012
Location: Somerset, UK

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by LGTrotter » 23:25 Fri 18 Jul 2014

Thank you.

User avatar
DRT
Fonseca 1966
Posts: 15020
Joined: 23:51 Wed 20 Jun 2007
Location: Chesterfield, UK
Contact:

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by DRT » 23:33 Fri 18 Jul 2014

The stage is yours…
"The first duty of Port is to be red"

Ernest H. Cockburn

User avatar
jdaw1
Taylor 1900
Posts: 19812
Joined: 15:03 Thu 21 Jun 2007
Location: London
Contact:

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by jdaw1 » 10:54 Sat 19 Jul 2014

LGTrotter wrote:I buy these magazines very sporadically and often by weight
You buy reading material by weight and then discover that the quality is unsatisfactory. That’s fine. But then why do you act surprised?

LGTrotter
Dalva Golden White Colheita 1952
Posts: 3684
Joined: 17:45 Fri 19 Oct 2012
Location: Somerset, UK

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by LGTrotter » 00:57 Tue 22 Jul 2014

jdaw1 wrote:
LGTrotter wrote:I buy these magazines very sporadically and often by weight
You buy reading material by weight and then discover that the quality is unsatisfactory. That’s fine. But then why do you act surprised?
As you are doubtless aware I do this partly for comic effect, like all good jokes there is a kernel of truth in it. I like a lot to read, I tend to nibble away at these magazines and I thought that this particular edition of Decanter would last a long time. On reflection I think that I nibble at them because they are indigestible. The wine awards section is almost unreadable, perhaps I am old fashioned but I have little interest in the wines of Croatia presented in a repetitive format. Quite soulless. And so large.

LGTrotter
Dalva Golden White Colheita 1952
Posts: 3684
Joined: 17:45 Fri 19 Oct 2012
Location: Somerset, UK

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by LGTrotter » 03:50 Sun 01 Feb 2015

jdaw1 wrote:This week’s Wine Folly: What Your Favorite Wine Says About You.
Image

Cabernet Sauvignon ⇒ “You like music with real instruments played by real musicians. You live by the motto: “No pain, no gain.” No one would dare use the word ‘subtle’ to describe your personality. Cabernet Sauvignon seems fitting.”

In which case, what does Port say?
The repetitive nature of wine journalism is one of the many problems it presents. To begin with lists. Why the *?@! do the writers think that lists are an inherently interesting way to present writing? They are the last word in lazy journalism. It is saying that a writer cannot even be bothered to put their writing into some coherent whole. So they just have written down bullet points and this gives the illusion of being punchy, but actually it is just lazy, or stupid, or some combination of the two. The other thing that annoys me about the above is that it has that sense of false bonne homie which infects so much journalism. In fact I think the main thing that annoys me about wine journalism is the journalists. This particular article was stamped out on the machine that does the problem page and horoscopes. God it's awful.

User avatar
flash_uk
Taylor Quinta de Vargellas 1987
Posts: 2445
Joined: 20:02 Thu 13 Feb 2014
Location: London

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by flash_uk » 09:12 Sun 01 Feb 2015

LGTrotter wrote:To begin with lists.
Completely agree that lists have reduced journalism to the lowest level of quality. Open any Saturday or Sunday paper and turn to the supplement sections for examples of this. The travel section is a serial offender. Top 50 places to go in Turkey, Top 10 romantic bolt holes in Siberia, Top 20 gastropubs which allow pets, and so on. Other supplement sections are no better. 10 ways to improve heart health, 10 secrets for sleeping well, 10 tips for saving energy. It is all crap.

Many times recently I have vowed never to buy another weekend paper. I still do, and the reading process involves a rapid page turn to see if there is anything interesting to read, rather than the experience I had hoped for which is a prolonged period of enjoyment reading several articles which are interesting and provide quality insight.

What is one to do?

PhilW
Dow 1980
Posts: 2506
Joined: 14:22 Wed 15 Dec 2010
Location: Near Cambridge, UK

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by PhilW » 09:59 Sun 01 Feb 2015

flash_uk wrote:
LGTrotter wrote:To begin with lists.
Completely agree that lists have reduced journalism to the lowest level of quality. Open any Saturday or Sunday paper and turn to the supplement sections for examples of this. The travel section is a serial offender. Top 50 places to go in Turkey, Top 10 romantic bolt holes in Siberia, Top 20 gastropubs which allow pets, and so on. Other supplement sections are no better. 10 ways to improve heart health, 10 secrets for sleeping well, 10 tips for saving energy. It is all crap.
I agree that many articles presenting lists are just quick lazy work, though not all - some can be very well thought out helpful or even insightful, but sadly they are the exception and lists have become quick and easy ways to generate content/revenue for many mixed media. Similarly, I have noticed a trend with a technology magazine I buy regularly that when reviewing products in an area, rather than a thorough examination of candidates with a specific focus (which they used to do well), most reviews these days feature a selection of disparate items and/or miss prime candidates, as if "some info about some products in the area" is somehow a substitute for a comprhensive covering of the particular product focus, which it is not. Although I still subscribe, I am not likely to do so for much longer, I think.

User avatar
djewesbury
Graham’s 1970
Posts: 8153
Joined: 20:01 Mon 31 Dec 2012
Location: Belfast
Contact:

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by djewesbury » 11:12 Sun 01 Feb 2015

Obviously the answer is stop reading wine magazines when we have all the required expertise here, at our fingertips.
Now, who'd like a commission to write up the 'Top 20 posts in Meaningless Drivel in 2014'?
Daniel J.
delete.. delete.. *sigh*.. delete...

User avatar
AW77
Morgan 1991
Posts: 1112
Joined: 20:20 Wed 25 Sep 2013
Location: Cologne, Germany

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by AW77 » 15:26 Sun 01 Feb 2015

The media wouldn't have switched to bullet point journalism if people still had time to read. So this was just a move to adapt to an ever faster pace of living. (I don't want to defend this kind of crap journalism, I just want to point to the root of the problem.)
The Eleventh Commandment: Thou shalt know thy Port

LGTrotter
Dalva Golden White Colheita 1952
Posts: 3684
Joined: 17:45 Fri 19 Oct 2012
Location: Somerset, UK

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by LGTrotter » 18:21 Sun 01 Feb 2015

AW77 wrote:The media wouldn't have switched to bullet point journalism if people still had time to read. So this was just a move to adapt to an ever faster pace of living. (I don't want to defend this kind of crap journalism, I just want to point to the root of the problem.)
I am unconvinced by the idea that journalists think we are all too busy to read. If that were the case I would not be getting about a wheelbarrow worth of assorted guff each time I buy a weekend paper. A glance at the latest novels all of which seem to start at 600 pages also undermines this argument.

User avatar
djewesbury
Graham’s 1970
Posts: 8153
Joined: 20:01 Mon 31 Dec 2012
Location: Belfast
Contact:

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by djewesbury » 21:00 Sun 01 Feb 2015

LGTrotter wrote:
AW77 wrote:The media wouldn't have switched to bullet point journalism if people still had time to read. So this was just a move to adapt to an ever faster pace of living. (I don't want to defend this kind of crap journalism, I just want to point to the root of the problem.)
I am unconvinced by the idea that journalists think we are all too busy to read. If that were the case I would not be getting about a wheelbarrow worth of assorted guff each time I buy a weekend paper. A glance at the latest novels all of which seem to start at 600 pages also undermines this argument.
Hmm. I tend to agree. I think journalists write this rubbish because that's all they're paid to write; because newspapers can't turn a profit any more and can't afford to employ anyone better.
Daniel J.
delete.. delete.. *sigh*.. delete...

LGTrotter
Dalva Golden White Colheita 1952
Posts: 3684
Joined: 17:45 Fri 19 Oct 2012
Location: Somerset, UK

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by LGTrotter » 12:07 Mon 02 Feb 2015

djewesbury wrote:
LGTrotter wrote:
AW77 wrote:The media wouldn't have switched to bullet point journalism if people still had time to read. So this was just a move to adapt to an ever faster pace of living. (I don't want to defend this kind of crap journalism, I just want to point to the root of the problem.)
I am unconvinced by the idea that journalists think we are all too busy to read. If that were the case I would not be getting about a wheelbarrow worth of assorted guff each time I buy a weekend paper. A glance at the latest novels all of which seem to start at 600 pages also undermines this argument.
Hmm. I tend to agree. I think journalists write this rubbish because that's all they're paid to write; because newspapers can't turn a profit any more and can't afford to employ anyone better.
Wouldn't it be great if there was someone, who was a regular, for instance, who had some experience of how to write critically. Eh, Daniel? Someone like that could help, I would have thought, eh, Daniel.

User avatar
djewesbury
Graham’s 1970
Posts: 8153
Joined: 20:01 Mon 31 Dec 2012
Location: Belfast
Contact:

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by djewesbury » 12:09 Mon 02 Feb 2015

If you are suggesting that I should consider getting into this idyllic world of free wine and free travel, then please carry on caressing my shell-like with the details of your proposal.
Daniel J.
delete.. delete.. *sigh*.. delete...

User avatar
AW77
Morgan 1991
Posts: 1112
Joined: 20:20 Wed 25 Sep 2013
Location: Cologne, Germany

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by AW77 » 13:46 Mon 02 Feb 2015

Daniel, could I act as your personal assistent in this free wine and free travel business?
The Eleventh Commandment: Thou shalt know thy Port

User avatar
djewesbury
Graham’s 1970
Posts: 8153
Joined: 20:01 Mon 31 Dec 2012
Location: Belfast
Contact:

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by djewesbury » 14:46 Mon 02 Feb 2015

AW77 wrote:Daniel, could I act as your personal assistent in this free wine and free travel business?
Consider yourself hired, as soon as Owen outlines my business plan.
Daniel J.
delete.. delete.. *sigh*.. delete...

User avatar
AW77
Morgan 1991
Posts: 1112
Joined: 20:20 Wed 25 Sep 2013
Location: Cologne, Germany

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by AW77 » 22:47 Mon 02 Feb 2015

Now Owen, what's the plan? We're all ears!
The Eleventh Commandment: Thou shalt know thy Port

User avatar
djewesbury
Graham’s 1970
Posts: 8153
Joined: 20:01 Mon 31 Dec 2012
Location: Belfast
Contact:

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by djewesbury » 23:02 Mon 02 Feb 2015

AW77 wrote:Now Owen, what's the plan? We're all ears!
Yeah come on, how do I break into this world of pleasure? I'm ready.
Daniel J.
delete.. delete.. *sigh*.. delete...

User avatar
jdaw1
Taylor 1900
Posts: 19812
Joined: 15:03 Thu 21 Jun 2007
Location: London
Contact:

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by jdaw1 » 23:11 Mon 02 Feb 2015

djewesbury wrote:I'm ready.
Young padawan, you have much to learn. For the pleasure you are not ready, and for you, the pleasure is not ready. Learn patience.

User avatar
djewesbury
Graham’s 1970
Posts: 8153
Joined: 20:01 Mon 31 Dec 2012
Location: Belfast
Contact:

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by djewesbury » 23:13 Mon 02 Feb 2015

I was born ready.
Daniel J.
delete.. delete.. *sigh*.. delete...

User avatar
djewesbury
Graham’s 1970
Posts: 8153
Joined: 20:01 Mon 31 Dec 2012
Location: Belfast
Contact:

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by djewesbury » 23:14 Mon 02 Feb 2015

:wink:
Daniel J.
delete.. delete.. *sigh*.. delete...

LGTrotter
Dalva Golden White Colheita 1952
Posts: 3684
Joined: 17:45 Fri 19 Oct 2012
Location: Somerset, UK

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by LGTrotter » 00:15 Tue 03 Feb 2015

djewesbury wrote:
AW77 wrote:Now Owen, what's the plan? We're all ears!
Yeah come on, how do I break into this world of pleasure? I'm ready.
Errr... Don't pressure me I'm thinking.

How about we fake articles about port in the style of famous wine writers (oxymoronic I know, but stay with me) panning a particular vintage, or bigging it up depending on whether we want to buy them or want to cash in, thus manipulating the market in the same way as Parker, not that he fakes anything M'lud, or would in any way be party to fraud. But I suppose we could ask if he would be prepared to lend us his reputation, come on what's the big deal, he's retiring isn't he?

Or we could fortify Riesling, have it served in a jam jar by a bloke in ill fitting red jeans with a beard. Make a mint. Job done.

User avatar
AHB
Quinta do Noval Nacional 1962
Posts: 11406
Joined: 13:41 Mon 25 Jun 2007
Location: Berkshire, UK

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by AHB » 08:23 Wed 04 Feb 2015

I like lists in my Sunday paper. When lying in bed with a hangover you can read the first three items, get bored, stagger to the bathroom, stagger back, fall back asleep for another half hour and then pick up where you left off. If I try to do the same with a 600 page book I have to go back and reread a whole load of pages.

Don't diss the list!
Top Port in 2017 (so far): Graham Stone Terraces 2015 and Quinta do Vesuvio 1994
2016 Port of the year: Cockburn 1908

PhilW
Dow 1980
Posts: 2506
Joined: 14:22 Wed 15 Dec 2010
Location: Near Cambridge, UK

Re: Wine Journalism: A Rich Seam of Unmined Moaning

Post by PhilW » 10:03 Wed 04 Feb 2015

djewesbury wrote:
AW77 wrote:Now Owen, what's the plan? We're all ears!
Yeah come on, how do I break into this world of pleasure? I'm ready.
Port futures trading? Clearly the best port ever will be produced in 2020 (since it has a zero on the end), so invest heavily now in futures, or even better create a market where everyone else can invest and you take a trading percentage. For everyone who invests in the scheme, use the funds to buy lots of old port, which you then have to drink at "marketing" events (tastings, possibly held in London and/or Porto) each week to discuss the merits of different old ports to attempt to predict what the future ones will taste like and make recommendations, to get more people to buy into the scheme. Name yourself Ponzi.

Post Reply