Bordeaux Recommendations

Anything but Port, this includes all non-Port fortified wines even if they call themselves Port. There is a search facility for this part of the forum.
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Anything but Port, this includes all non-Port fortified wines even if they call themselves Port. There is a search facility for this part of the forum.
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djewesbury
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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by djewesbury » 17:27 Wed 23 Jul 2014

mosesbotbol wrote:stealing candy from a baby kind of prices.
see previous post ^
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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by AHB » 23:51 Wed 23 Jul 2014

DRT wrote:...1989 to 2009, classic years only...
Excellent. So now we can argue about which years fall into that category. I vote 1992, 1993 and 2002. Who's next?
Top Ports in 2019: Niepoort VV (1960s bottling) and Quinta do Noval Nacional 2017
Top Ports in 2020 (so far): Croft 1945 and Niepoort VV (1960s bottling)

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djewesbury
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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by djewesbury » 00:02 Thu 24 Jul 2014

AHB wrote:
DRT wrote:...1989 to 2009, classic years only...
Excellent. So now we can argue about which years fall into that category. I vote 1992, 1993 and 2002. Who's next?
I vote 2000, 2004 and 2006, since I've bought a reasonable amount of each!
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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by DRT » 00:29 Thu 24 Jul 2014

Are we talking micro-climate variations or generally highly regarded years?

If the latter I vote 1989, 1990, 1995, 1996, 1998(?), 2000, 2005 and 2009.

All intervening years are acceptable from selective sub-regions.

My current focus for accumulation is 2005.
"The first duty of Port is to be red"
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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by LGTrotter » 00:33 Thu 24 Jul 2014

AHB wrote:
DRT wrote:...1989 to 2009, classic years only...
Excellent. So now we can argue about which years fall into that category. I vote 1992, 1993 and 2002. Who's next?

I refuse to rise to this very gaudy fly. I hope that Derek recognises this attempt at irony otherwise he will never speak to Alex again after the first bottle of 1992.

Sorry Daniel, not fond of the 2004.

Does nobody like a bit of sweetness in their claret?

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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by LGTrotter » 00:36 Thu 24 Jul 2014

DRT wrote:My current focus for accumulation is 2005.
They have closed down a lot, at least I hope this is what they've done, otherwise I've got a lot of stiff claret to get through. Funny because they were exuberant in youth.

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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by DRT » 00:44 Thu 24 Jul 2014

LGTrotter wrote:
DRT wrote:My current focus for accumulation is 2005.
They have closed down a lot, at least I hope this is what they've done, otherwise I've got a lot of stiff claret to get through. Funny because they were exuberant in youth.
Closed down will work well for me. Lots of them opening up 10-15-20 years from now would be a good result.

What about my list? Are there any lemons in there that I should avoid?
"The first duty of Port is to be red"
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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by DRT » 00:46 Thu 24 Jul 2014

LGTrotter wrote:I hope that Derek recognises this attempt at irony
I have known AHB for many a year. Fear not, I am tuned into his humour.
"The first duty of Port is to be red"
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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by LGTrotter » 00:58 Thu 24 Jul 2014

DRT wrote:
LGTrotter wrote:I hope that Derek recognises this attempt at irony
I have known AHB for many a year. Fear not, I am tuned into his humour.
But why does he torture me so? Nineteen-ninety-freakin-two?

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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by DRT » 01:05 Thu 24 Jul 2014

LGTrotter wrote:
DRT wrote:
LGTrotter wrote:I hope that Derek recognises this attempt at irony
I have known AHB for many a year. Fear not, I am tuned into his humour.
But why does he torture me so? Nineteen-ninety-freakin-two?
You are still the new boy. Take it like a man or bulb like a girl. Your choice.
"The first duty of Port is to be red"
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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by LGTrotter » 01:11 Thu 24 Jul 2014

DRT wrote:bulb like a girl.
That sounds like me.

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djewesbury
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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by djewesbury » 01:14 Thu 24 Jul 2014

LGTrotter wrote:
DRT wrote:bulb like a girl.
That sounds like me.
Really? Can you do that? How exciting! I'm looking forward to the Port Walk even more now.
God I love Gene Clark.
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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by DRT » 01:26 Thu 24 Jul 2014

djewesbury wrote:
LGTrotter wrote:
DRT wrote:bulb like a girl.
That sounds like me.
Really? Can you do that? How exciting! I'm looking forward to the Port Walk even more now.
God I love Gene Clark.
Hot crumpet anyone?
"The first duty of Port is to be red"
Ernest H. Cockburn

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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by LGTrotter » 01:29 Thu 24 Jul 2014

DRT wrote:Hot crumpet anyone?
Oooh please!

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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by LGTrotter » 19:41 Thu 24 Jul 2014

DRT wrote:Are we talking micro-climate variations or generally highly regarded years?

If the latter I vote 1989, 1990, 1995, 1996, 1998(?), 2000, 2005 and 2009.

All intervening years are acceptable from selective sub-regions.

My current focus for accumulation is 2005.
I would vote for all of the above. But I don't know much about the 98. Right bank did well I hear, I'm more of a rive gauche man. Do not despise the 88s, while a bit stern to start with even Alex would approve of their lines today.

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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by AHB » 18:28 Fri 25 Jul 2014

LGTrotter wrote:
DRT wrote:Are we talking micro-climate variations or generally highly regarded years?

If the latter I vote 1989, 1990, 1995, 1996, 1998(?), 2000, 2005 and 2009.

All intervening years are acceptable from selective sub-regions.

My current focus for accumulation is 2005.
I would vote for all of the above. But I don't know much about the 98. Right bank did well I hear, I'm more of a rive gauche man. Do not despise the 88s, while a bit stern to start with even Alex would approve of their lines today.
It is true. I disliked the 1988s at first, finding them too stern, but now find them very enjoyable. I can't help but draw a parallel with the 1978s.

And it is also true that I was not serious in recommending 1992 as a claret vintage to buy!
Top Ports in 2019: Niepoort VV (1960s bottling) and Quinta do Noval Nacional 2017
Top Ports in 2020 (so far): Croft 1945 and Niepoort VV (1960s bottling)

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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by djewesbury » 19:11 Fri 25 Jul 2014

The 1978s are rather lovely!
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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by LGTrotter » 19:49 Fri 25 Jul 2014

djewesbury wrote:The 1978s are rather lovely!
'The year of the miracle' as Harry Waugh said. The main miracle being that they managed to sell them. But seriously they haven't turned out too bad, from the few I've tried. Not sure many of them will still be going now.

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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by DRT » 21:51 Fri 25 Jul 2014

OK, if we are going back from 1989 I need some help with my education.

I have tasted wines from 1982, 1986 and 1988 and really enjoyed them. All were from familiar producers, no rubbish. From the 1970s I think all I have had are Chasse-Spleen, Gloria and Sales 1970. The latter is very tired. The CS is only just drinkable if you do it quickly. The Gloria is glorious.

Which other 1970s and 1980s vintages do I need to look out for?
"The first duty of Port is to be red"
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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by djewesbury » 01:32 Sat 26 Jul 2014

LGTrotter wrote:
djewesbury wrote:The 1978s are rather lovely!
'The year of the miracle' as Harry Waugh said. The main miracle being that they managed to sell them. But seriously they haven't turned out too bad, from the few I've tried. Not sure many of them will still be going now.
Well since Justin viewed it as a public service that I take his 78s off his hands I obliged. Terrible, horrible, rancid juice. Don't know how I've managed it.
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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by AHB » 15:00 Sat 26 Jul 2014

DRT wrote:OK, if we are going back from 1989 I need some help with my education.

I have tasted wines from 1982, 1986 and 1988 and really enjoyed them. All were from familiar producers, no rubbish. From the 1970s I think all I have had are Chasse-Spleen, Gloria and Sales 1970. The latter is very tired. The CS is only just drinkable if you do it quickly. The Gloria is glorious.

Which other 1970s and 1980s vintages do I need to look out for?
For me, with my distinct preference for left bank wines, I like wines from the following years from those decades:
1989, 1988, 1986, 1985, 1983, 1982, (1980 sometimes), 1979 (sometimes), 1978, 1970. Most of the wine from the '70s is well past it now.

And if you want to go back another decade it is 1967 (selectively), 1966, 1964 (selectively), 1961, 1959.

The '80s was a great decade for left bank wines.
Top Ports in 2019: Niepoort VV (1960s bottling) and Quinta do Noval Nacional 2017
Top Ports in 2020 (so far): Croft 1945 and Niepoort VV (1960s bottling)

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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by LGTrotter » 16:20 Sat 26 Jul 2014

I would with a few reservations support what Alex has said.
To add some colour I would say of the eighties that the 1989 is probably my favourite vintage, never had a dud, it seems very consistent top to bottom. Next would come the 1985 with the proviso that they do not have the same strength in depth that the 89s have and you do have to be a bit careful lower down the pecking order, they are beautiful wines but quite gentle now, I wonder if they will fall apart in the not too distant. The 88s are similar if a bit less expressive, I think they will last better than any other vintage of the eighties, apart from perhaps the 89s. The 86 I find a bit heavy, they are to some people's taste but not mine, similar to the 82s but the 82s have a bit more sweetness. I don't know if I have been unlucky with the relatively few 82s I've had but I quite actively dislike them. They seem quite distinctive but are characterised by feeling a bit top heavy, unbalanced, cooked, that sort of thing. The 83 is 'classic' for want of a better word, I have had some lovely Margaux which I bought when they were under the radar, but they seem fully priced now. Had a couple of 81s which were no better than OK. Can't think of any 80s I've tried.

The seventies I have tried too sporadically to say much other than it is rare to feel I got my money's worth apart from some 70. A few odd nice surprises, I had a 71 years ago which I really liked. 75s I tried a few and didn't like. 78 was OK but no more.

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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by DRT » 16:55 Sat 26 Jul 2014

Thank you both.

1983 and 1985 are vintage I have not yet approached so will look out for some. I am likely to avoid wines from the 1970s.
"The first duty of Port is to be red"
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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by djewesbury » 19:32 Sat 26 Jul 2014

We will have a 78 and an 83 when you are in Belfast.
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Re: Bordeaux Recommendations

Post by LGTrotter » 11:29 Sun 27 Jul 2014

djewesbury wrote:
LGTrotter wrote:
djewesbury wrote:The 1978s are rather lovely!
'The year of the miracle' as Harry Waugh said. The main miracle being that they managed to sell them. But seriously they haven't turned out too bad, from the few I've tried. Not sure many of them will still be going now.
Well since Justin viewed it as a public service that I take his 78s off his hands I obliged. Terrible, horrible, rancid juice. Don't know how I've managed it.
You had the 78 Giscours I think, which was nice ten years ago.

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